Edgar Ramirez Interview For The Fantastic ‘Carlos’ [Part 1]

I recently had the opportunity of speaking to Edgar Ramirez about his epic new movie ‘Carlos’. A film anchored by a enigmatically multi layered performance from Mr Ramirez in the role of the notorious, convicted Venezuelan terrorist Carlos the Jackal (Ilich Ramirez Sanchez) – one of the most wanted terrorists on the planet. Between 1974, in London, where he tried to assassinate a British businessman, and 1994, when he was arrested in Khartoum, he lived several lives under various pseudonyms, weaving his way through the complexities of international politics of the period. Check out what he had to say below. Part 2 of my interview will be up Thursday 21st.

How much of Carlos did you know before you accepted the role? And what intrigued and fascinated you about it?

Edgar Ramirez: I didn’t know that much. I just knew the general knowledge about the character, the immediate media image that probably most people have – a mysterious Venezuelan that put bombs across Europe and that he was a master of disguise. A guy who was described in many suspense and thriller books, nothing much more than that. The reason why I was attracted to the character was the level of complexity that the character offered. It’s a character full of contradictions and multi layers. It was very, very challenging. In this case it was probably the most challenging character I have played so far. Not only because of the level of contradiction, but also because of the extension of the characters study, we’re probably talking about twenty five years in the life of the character. We first see him when he’s around twenty one/twenty two, then at the end he’s forty five, so in the course of five and half hours [the length of the movie] we had the opportunity to fully explore the character in a huge deal of extension. It was fascinating, it’s great for any actor to explore so extensively the life of your character. It was fantastic.

How do you prepare for such a role?

Edgar Ramirez: First I read as much as I could about contemporary history in order to understand the geo-politics of the time. The political context and the historical context of where all the characters lived in, that was so important. Then I tried to watch and read as much documentation available about Carlos and the image, the myth. It was very important to understand the perception that the media had about this character, and the opinions of people. Then I tried to have as many interviews as I could with people who were close to the real guy, in order to get more personal inputs that I could use in the mix. Then I poured all of this into the character that Olivier had already written, which was already very complex and contradictory. Then I just let go (laughs).

The shear ambition of the film is gigantic, as you said yourself the films covers around twenty five years of this guys life. With shooting in different continents and speaking in so many languages was it hard to keep track of what was going on in the production? It must have been a hazy experience.

Edgar Ramirez: If I told you I had a plan with how the character would be I would be lying (laughs). I think at certain points everything seemed so big, and so extensive, and complicated that if I had sat down to plan and think about it, I would have gone mad. So I tried to have a general scope of what the character should develop into, but I never had a very specific idea because I think everybody, including Olivier, were kind of discovering who these characters were as we were making the movie. Somehow we trusted that the characters would speak to us, the characters would somehow reveal themselves to us. That was a quite a challenging and interesting experience, just to be out in the open and experimenting. That’s what we tried to do.

With the weight changes, that was clear from the start because many pictures that we had of the real guy show him fat in the later days of his life as a free man. So that was clear that the character was going to go through major physical transformations. So for the character I had to lose weight first and try to become a twenty two year old boy again. Then I had to take more than that weight back and gain more weight. Then I had to lose almost two sizes again and then get them back (laughs), I lost like six kilos at the beginning, then I gained them back in the course of the shoot, then I gained almost seventeen kilos more. I was supervised but I still had some residuals on how it affected my body. I took care and it was ok, but I became a little allergic to dairy and corn, things I wasn’t allergic too before. It was worth it though.

Was there a characteristic of the role that you found more challenging? Seeing as you had to deal with so many different layers.

Edgar Ramirez: I remember when I was preparing, all the materials I was reading about Carlos he was always depicted either as a cold blooded killer, or a superficial, almost vain clown. Like the guy would have no ideology at all,  he did everything because he was vain and superficial. That was hard for me because based on those notions it was very difficult for me to establish certain connections. I felt that according to that information it was too superficial, there was no real motivation. It was difficult for me to bridge and understand this guy and say ’ok, whether I like it or not, he did this because of this, because of he’s a real reason’. That was hard until I talked to his family. Then I felt like I could get closer to the real guy.

Although we were not trying to do a biography, I wanted to get it as close to reality as possible. I needed something substantial to hold on to. Talking to his family and discovering that this was a guy trying to survive, also just survive the political changes and alliances. For example his brother explained to me when I asked him ’Do you think that your brother became his own ideology at a point in time?’ And he said ‘of course.’ For example if you’re working for the red ones against the blue ones, then two years later the blue ones and the red ones pact. Where does that leave you? It’s not  like you can wake up in the morning and say ‘you know what, I’m done with terrorism, here’s my resignation letter’ (laughs). You can’t do that, you’re already seen as a criminal. When I realised that then I said ok, there’s a weakness, there’s a crack to get to his humanity. Then I saw a real person, then I started from there.

As Edgar I would never endorse any kind of violence to defend or mobilise any political, ideology or religious conviction, but I cannot encroach my own ideas on my characters. It’s not about me, it’s about them. So I had to find a way to understand his motivations. That’s how the process started for me. I could see someone who was alive and interesting. Not just someone who was a myth, because myths and legends are flat, there’s no complexity. A cold blooded terrorist, what’s that? That’s just a label, there’s nothing interesting about that. A superficial clown, there’s nothing to extract. So I tried to find the thread through all the different dimensions of him.

With such a complex character was it hard not to form your own opinions of him?

Edgar Ramirez: He was so many things at the same time, so I tried not to form any opinion. I think over-intellectualising too much the whole process would have worked against the character. He was too complex, there were too many different versions of the guy, there were too many different identity’s. I didn’t want to give too much thought into it, too many opinions, because at the end it’s not a biography, it’s not like we are trying to tell the truth of Carlos. First of all because no one will ever know the truth. There’s always going to be so many grey areas. We never intended to do a biography. For me it was just important to go through the experiences of the character minute after minute. What was a very important trait to this character was that he was more about tactics than strategy. He made choices more on impulse – which is what you see in the movie – without really seeing the consequences of the choices he is making. Throughout he’s faced with the consequences of his errors and impulsive choices over and over and over and over again until the end. Then probably in an unconscious level to go along with that and go with the flow, I didn’t want to think about it too much.

Release Date: 22 October 2010 / Certificate: 15

Movie Runtime: 246 minutes/ Trilogy Runtime: 338 minutes